Mega Coins, negatively impacting the competitiveness for more money


#162

As @CheekyGrinch pointed out, you are both working with different units which always causes confusion. :joy::joy: (Another math geek here > :nerd_face: )
While your 4:3 ratio is correct when dealing with individual energy, we are discussing Energy Packs to Inner Fire ratio.

At the lowest form, 1 energy pack = 16 energy = 4 attacks = 12 inner fires (16 energy = 12 inners gives the 4:3 ratio) but since energy doesn’t drop individually than we must use the 1 pack = 12 inners or 1:12.

Based off this there should be one energy pack dropping per 12 inner fires dropped. Obviously we cannot be too linear nor can we expect randomized drops to be scheduled so we will most likely need to maintain the status quo with this one.

Some people have too many energy packs, others have too many inner fires. I don’t have enough of either :cry::cry::cry:

On a side note energy continually refills at a slow rate whereas inner fires do not. This makes inner fires inherently more valuable and necessary for event progression. In my eyes that means they need a higher drop rate than energy. :blush:


#163

This also does not take into account that refill costs get progressively more restrictive so that the originally determined ratios are wildly off after a couple of refills.


#164

That is correct but we are simply discussing base rate as far as I am aware. I don’t have the information on single use energy pack scaling to extrapolate a specific event wide ratio. I only purchase one 100 energy bundle once every round (reset period), I havent bought 16 energy in more than a year so I have no clue how cost progression scales. :blush:


#165

Summary: @pgjared if you can’t take away the mega coin and bring back the bonus meter. Can you consider disabling it in the last hour?


#166

I understand where you are coming from, but you need to understand the phrase over complicating it. It is basic math bud not some complicated formula. I’m sure someone smart can spin the numbers to mean whatever they want but take a step back and analyze it from a practical standpoint not an abstract.

You are breaking the concept down too small. The only amount of energy that matters in this game is 4, 20, and 100, and then 16 for the energy pack, or 100 for a bonus buy. Not sure what a single pack caps out at but I think it’s 5. So a single “unit” as you are fond of the term of energy would actually be 4, as 1 is useless. So 5 energy for 4 “units” of energy. With a total of 12 possible inners to be used. If we are talking about maximizing scoring via drops, an ideal drop rate would be somewhere around 3:1 inner fires. Sure you can use one, or 2 or none, but I don’t think that’s what we are talking about. At the end of each event I have usually 80-120 packs left over, as a free player. I have between 0 and 20 inners left over.

Knowing this, as I am a bit of a war dragons nerd, I have created my own in game economy that allows me to score well in every event. As a free player you will get the energy needed to achieve top tier rewards in an event, but you will never, ever, acquire the necessary amount of inner fire needed. Not without taking a break for a couple events and meticulously saving inners, in which case you can cap out maybe 1 a year. At that point you will have 8-900 energy packs left over. It’s not just a small difference, but a HUGE one bud.


#167

Lol…it’s ok to be cheeky…cheeky…yes, well, energy does come in packs of 16…inner fire come individually, though they may be purchased or acquired in sets, but are independent of energy…As two separate consumables, one being the cost of an attack in pvp events (energy) and the other being a spell that can be equipped on a dragon, the rate of consumption is the primary problem which starts at 4:3 and should dictate the economy of acquisition rates…well…unless PG sees value in building stockpiles for players.


#168

Actually…I am breaking it down to it’s simplest form for you. You are focusing on variables that have little to nothing to do with the problem. This IS basic math… unfortunately the only spinning is from you focusing on the items…not their supply rates nor the ACTUAL consumption rate. Seriously…I can’t make this any simpler without being insulting myself. So let’s just leave it be.


#169

Almost completely right…except as I noted in previous posts, the drop rates, or acquisition rates heavily weigh toward IF’s…thus the massive 4K+ stockpile of IF’s I have and the sample study I did on the last pvp (also noted above). That’s where the supply comes into the equation via the game economics. It is not impossible to stockpile energy, it just means one has to use IF on lots of runs where energy is not used or solely acquire energy via purchases…all leading back to my original statement that the drop rate for IF’s should be changed OR allow for some other economic mechanism to exchange them and other consumables that are stockpiled…


#170

I believe the issue is that you are skipping a step, and calculating using 4 Energy Packs, rather than 4 energy, being used for 1 attack.

The rewards you get from chests are Energy Packs and Inner Fires.

If you buy the small (16 energy) refill, 1 Energy Pack, at first purchase, gives you 16 energy. You need 4 energy for a single attack. At 4 energy per attack, 1 Energy Pack = 16 energy = 4 attacks. (this is the step I believe you are skipping)
4 attacks, with 3 dragons per attack = 12 Inner Fires.
So, at the cheapest cost, 1 Energy Pack is used and 12 Inner fires are used. 1 Energy Pack = 12 Inner Fires.

In my earlier post, I used the 100 energy purchase because that is what I use. In that example,
10 Energy Packs = 100 energy = 25 attacks
25 attacks, with 3 dragons per attack = 75 Inner Fires
So 10 Energy Packs = 75 Inner Fires.
While the number of Energy Packs needed to purchase additional energy does rise, at the worst case, it takes 30 Energy packs to buy 100 energy.
So 30 Energy Packs = 100 energy = 25 attacks.
25 attacks, with 3 dragons per attack = 75 Inner Fires
So, at worst for the big purchase, 30 Energy packs = 75 Inner Fires.
Same goes for the small (16 energy) purchase, 5 Energy Packs = 16 energy = 4 attacks
4 attacks, with 3 dragons per attack = 12 Inner Fires
So 5 Energy Packs = 12 Inner Fires.

Inner Fires are used much more in 3-dragon attacks than Energy Packs (not energy). I am not sure how you ended up with such a large stockpile of Inner Fires; I struggle with them every PVP event while I am sitting on a lot of Energy Packs. If anything, my feeling is that Inner Fire drop rates should be increased, not decreased.


#171

I’m probably just an idiot but I always manage to have either a stockpile of one and bare scraps of another or the complete opposite during most events. There have been events where I’ll end up still holding 100 energy packs and haven’t had IF for 3 days and other events where I’ll have no energy to spare but end up with 150 fire never getting a chance to be used.


#172

Ahh but that is your personal truth with random drops. Other people have reported excess energy packs. Myself I get excess of neither.

Your calculations may work off what you have personally witnessed in game but that is untrue for other players.


#173

Ok let’s use pictures. Explain to me how I have too many inner fires. Figuring an avrrage cost of 25 packs per 100 for a baseline, I have enough packs to purchase 700 energy, which could use at minimum 700 inners. So again, no. Energy drops frequently, inners at the same rate but are consumed at a much higher rate. I have more than enough energy to use 700 inner fires, yet only have enough to use not even a third of that. I’m sure if we get more pictures it will be the same in majority of cases.


#174

If it’s truly a random drop, or even a set percentage drop (which is not random), then there shouldn’t be significant swings period. Is it possible that PG has added in variables that are specific to accounts, OS, or devices? Yes, but PG says no…so there should be no ‘personal’ experience that differs outside of standard deviations…no matter how you spin it though, surely all can agree that there should be some economic mechanism to exchange stockpiled consumables, right?


#175

Not once did I say ‘you’ had too many of anything and cleary what I have said isn’t sinkin In and honestly it is ok if you don’t get it…I have simply made an observat And floated an idea that apparently people wish to argue separate points or have absolutely no understanding of the simple economics of the game. The premise you are providing is not what I have said"…it is still a misconception of the costs of each attack. Thank you for engaging in the topic and much luck to you.


#176

Seriously, this thread is still going? All I see are the same people making the same complaints, over and over.

Not sure if you have noticed, but the Coin is here, hasn’t changed, hasn’t even been mentioned if they are reviewing it to change it, and has been in all but one (I think) PVP events since its debut.

Pretty confident that it isn’t going anywhere and/or it’s use being restricted anytime soon (but I would love PG to chime in and say otherwise, which they won’t…)


#177

There was the “not yet decided” reply a while back, so it’s pretty much still either way.


#178

Yeah, I’m not looking at how old that reply is. For comparison, check out the Atlas shields in event thingies thread…was open for a month, 14 responses, they used that as “ammo” to do a shieldless event :man_shrugging:

The wheels of PG move slowly - granted they won’t share what decisions are forthcoming about, well, anything…so yeah. Maybe they will change it by the time I have a grandkid…which is a few years off still (I hope, better be a few years…)


#179

The drop rate is 15:20 for energy packs to IF in legendary gold drops, right?..if you can use 4x inner fire than energy, I am confused why energy needs the increase. I’m not trying to argue or be a pain I just really am confused


#180

I can just imagine how much PG laughs at this thread… I would LOVE to see the statistics of people who have complained about MCs and then used them in events. And I understand you may need to use them in some of the higher levels to stay competitive, but this will NEVER change if spenders continue to use them. You want them gone? Put your money where your mouth is and stop using them. It may cost you in the event, but that is what it takes to cause actual change. 179 posts in a forum < PGs vastly increasing bank account… (And don’t get me wrong, I don’t blame them for that at all…They are a business…)


#181

Not sure where you would use 4x’s IF than energy… that would require doing more than 4x’s as many backup runs for teammates with IF on your dragon if your own attacks use three dragons all equipped with IF. So assuming you go with a ‘normal’ attack and use 4 energy, then attack with three dragons with equipped IF, you will have used 4 E to 3 IF…or simply one fewer IF . That’s just at normal attack rate … super attacks cost 20 E and you can still only use a maximum of 3 IF on that attack… mega attacks are worse if you purchase since now you actually BUY them with 100 E and 20 IF even though the ratio is better than super attacks. Most players on the teams I’ve been on use super attacks and normal attacks primarily with rare usage of megas.

In the last pvp, the drop rate of both in gold chests was more like 1:1.05 favoring IF, so for all intents it is the same, but since we consume more energy than IF my total IF increased again by the end of the event.

The primary purpose of what I originally said was that many consumables are dropped at a rate above normal usage… assuming they spend some on gold chests… being able to exchange or spend them on other consumables like what was originally proposed in the beta forge would be great or even sharing excess with teammates… just so they’re not stockpiling…