Possible new primarch type?


#1

Throwing an idea out there to hear some feedback. What would players think of a primarch with the following functions:

De-Buff Type Primarch

  • Special Ability: de-buffs opponent’s player base strength for X minutes by Y% (ie: reduces player tower HP and ATK by 10% or some number)
  • Special Ability possibly also de-buff the opponent’s primarch stats?
  • Relatively mediocre to weak Attack rating
  • Relatively mediocre to weak Defense rating
  • De-buff %'s stack depending on the number of players who use the special ability
  • The de-buff only effects attacks on the player’s primarch (don’t affect main game)
  • The de-buff % would scale based upon the players primarch troop count vs troop capacity (ie: Primarch can hold 100 troops, but only has 50 troops. 50/100 = 50% so this primarch can apply 50% of its max debuff)

1 troop "strategy", no GP for riders.
#2

It seems interesting, though has the potential to be unbalanced. Higher level bases will also be hit harder, and if it’s meant to balance things out for newer/future teams, it could be difficult for them to obtain, while being too easy for the teams it’s meant to help counter. If it’s just as something new, sure.

Also, how does it work with boosted core game bases? There’s some uncertainty with whether boosts/perches (riders & dragons) work on Atlas bases.

Like a base-wise weaker intimidating roar?

I think it’d make the primarch overpowered, unless it’s not by much or its own attack/def ratings are extremely low, making it dependent upon other primarchs, if this is done. Would this effect stack?

Say that three players use it, does it nerf the base for everyone attacking or only those three/their other primarchs? I’m guessing the former but just checking.


#3

The idea for it is to be used in conjunction with a number of players from a team in a coordinated action. In this we would attempt to create a situation where strategy/activity can overcome some amount of level gap.

  • Dragon perches will be added into the Atlas base.
  • This buff would act the same way as the Tower +HP & Tower +Atk consumables in the game, but have a negative %.
  • The de-buff would be for a short duration, something like 10 minutes so attacks must be coordinated.
  • The attack stats of the primarch would be quite weak or I agree it would be a bit too strong.
  • Perhaps it doesn’t de-buff primarch stats, but agree if it did maybe its something small like 5%.
  • The de-buff effect would stack
  • The de-buff does nerf the base for everyone attacking, not just the player who used the special ability

#4

So basically is a sacrifice Prime? Can’t kill, can’t attack, but being there makes it easier for teammates to do both of those things?

My concern is that it would be completely useless without its Buff, and in large scale battles there are a lot of Rushers around… so i’m not sure how well it would work unless its buff was immune to a rushers trap ability.


#5

Why not just give Fighters this ability as it’s passive? Every new team that enters atlas has Level 1 Fighters, and they are at a HUGE disadvantage because they do not have the boosts from leveling a castle’s infrastructure and leveling their primarchs. Don’t take away their attack and defense stats tho… they are quick to summon and quick to die…


#6

I think its most consistent if a Rusher’s trap prevents this debuffer from using its ability too. However, I don’t think it would cancel the effect of an ability already used. For example, perhaps we make the active ability spray corrosive slime on the enemy towers (think Slimer) … once the slime has been applied, there’s a recharge period before slime can be used again and a Rusher which traps this new Primarch wouldn’t magically make that slime go away.

I think this Primarch would pretty clearly benefit coordinated teams (irrespective of league/level). Pretty excited about it myself. I agree with @XxTrueOnexX and others that it probably should be available early, but I’m not so sure that giving the Fighter this valuable ability is the best way to achieve this. To Echo’s point, this new primarch needs to have some tradeoffs – if it’s strength is in debuffing others, then it probably at a minimum needs to be a sub-optimal attacker.


#7

damn you Dave. You had to bring ghostbusters into it. OF COURSE i agree now! that’s a trump card! well played.

but to go back to TrueOne’s idea and what you just said:

Fighter is already sub-optimal. As of now there is no reason to level it past level 5… maybe not give it this ability until level 6?


#8

Haha, good times.

The Fighter is less effective than other Primarchs – at max level. But it’s also easier to level up and actually a pretty good investment for new players (not that there’s any choice about the first 5 levels anyway), imo. I think the slime primarch should probably be even weaker (at offense) than the Fighter. This keeps the bar a bit higher – teams which can coordinate some players with the slime primarchs and others with fighters (we’re talking about early teams here) will do better than a team that doesn’t coordinate and everyone blindly builds fighters. Perhaps.


#9

i just edited my above post but in case you didn’t notice… how about not giving the fighter the ability until after level 5?


#10

I shall revisit to write a more thoughtful response, but my immediate reaction is basically this (and I skipped reading a few responses)

Is the idea that you would need to target a primarch, forming a 1:1 relationship like trap, but with the ability to have many-to-one relationships?

I think the concept of providing a tactical way to overcome levels is almost certainly necessary within careful limits.

I am concerned this could be exploited to make the strongest team be as vulnerable as those in the safe zone.

  • I assume the troop scaling is to make strongest team about most troops. I think this may be the right idea, but you may need some limits
    • possibly limit troop acquisition more. I can currently afford to amass armies far bigger than I should (I’d hate to destroy someone by amping up a primarch to max with $$ And using a second primarch to destroy someone
    • possibly ensure more than troops are needed to make it useful - multiple primarchs should be needed for more reason than because the primarch can’t hold more troops.
    • possibly defending against this should be possible both by having more troops and more high level players, so land holding needs more than one clutch player/primarch. - this may already be satisfied by current criteria depending on implementation
    • you may need to limit abuse so that someone can’t simply make an alliance of many many minimum level players to debuff an entire team and then have one strongish player destroy.

Again, I think the idea is good, and probably is necessary with the correct implementation.

Have you thought about making such a primarch on the same tier as the fighter with short summon? Maybe a very weak version of it for beginning teams.


#11

Stop considering adding stuff until you fix the fundamental issues with Atlas, please.


#12

I believe this is being proposed to fix a fundamental issue. (Or work towards that goal)

Which issues do you consider fundamental?

This would work towards leveling the playing field for a single high level player being their own unstoppable army, and as a result make a lot of land available to steal with the right strategy.


#13

My issue is this… what is the point in being a level 350 player or having put in 2 years worth of game time if now some player as a 100 with 2 months in game can wreck your base. There should be no way a level 100 could beat a 400. I would rather see a fix to the amount of base buyers and hackers and exploits that made all these level 400s in game. When you talk about whales like princess dread or scoopmaster who are huge players naturally and have been around a long time those are bases and players that should dominate and have little opposition. And now we are flooded with 400s that no one has ever heard of. This is in large part because of discount pack buying things like that, but I don’t believe we need to take the stature of being a big player away. Small players should not be able to topple larger players, otherwise why even have a level system


#14

I don’t feel this new primarch fixes any fundamental issue or is necessary to the game.


#15

Atlas is a team game. Any 1 player of any size should not make or break a team. (IMO)

I think some adjustments would be needed, but If you aren’t the only 350 on your team it might actually benefit you more than hurt you.
(Assuming it is implemented well)

If you are carrying a team by yourself, this might be aimed at you. Not everyone can win.


#16

Do you beliebe a single player should make or break a team?

I do think adjustments are needed here, and that’s what I think this aims to do.

I personally think this is needed. Much of the land is held by a single large player, allowing the team contribution to matter less than a single player to be an army of 1. We probably agree to disagree, but I’m curious if you consider this a problem or not.


#17

Just my thoughts…could these just be abilities to add to current primarchs and maybe it has 6 possible abilities and you can only select 3 at a time? Leveling the ones most people have has been pretty intense and this goes beyond the scope of just this but…at the moment Atlas is almost so team intensive that unless a bunch of people get on you can’t get anything done. Perhaps giving more flexibility to the current ones would make it easier? Because I can say from doing a few huge battles…rushers are great but you literally sit there and just hit trap…and thats it, taunter…even less. You are basically just there to spectate.


#18

It would be one-to-one like the Rusher trap. So you could slime one specific enemy and then you’d have to wait some time for your slime to regenerate before you could slime again (cooldown timer wouldn’t reset if you resummon your Slimer to prevent abuse, since unlike the Rusher the slime does not go away if someone kills your slimer primarch [a Rusher’s trap end early if the Rusher is killed]).

@MikesGoN2GetU @EidolonRM Definitely worth considering putting on the same tier as the fighter. I don’t think the summon time makes much difference, but that’d be a factor to consider when deciding on the tier.

@xJJSK2018x Atlas is a team sport. If they can wreck your base, it won’t be because of one slimer. It’ll be because they brought a lot of slimers, and you and your team didn’t take any action to counter them. In practice, being high level will still be incredibly valuable – but not a license to throw one’s weight around against other talented, committed groups of players without consequences.

@Panda I think that might be too complex for now, but maybe higher tier Primarchs of the future could pursue this. Maybe via Primarch gear or their Riders. (Just floating random ideas atm.)


#19

But you could have multiple teammates “slime” the same target for a stacked debuff?

Then the control points become max troops for that primarch, and max number of primarchs that can stack their slime? Or maybe more max percent debuffed

Would the number of troops the target has impact (prevent debuff/require more) or would the sheer numbers needed to be killed alone provide that?

Trying to poke holes in it: if someone brought in an account into their team (thereby getting atlas) and then aquired said primarch (normal resources and speeds) and then slimed. If they then left the team, would the slime stay in play? (Rinse and repeat for abuse)


#20

@PGDave I think the hardest part of what the Atlas is the amount of time/effort it takes to go anything but hit the mine really, if you want to do anything else it takes a monumental amount of both plus a large group is needed and its hard to organize currently. I thought more primarchs would just add to the confusion for most.