Possible new primarch type?


Then try this tactic:

  1. Build up till you have 500k-1mil troops

(this is 1-2 weeks worth of building)

  1. Hit just enough PVP attacks that your fighter prime levels to lvl 5, research a destroyer and a rusher level 1, get the second slot

  2. Build some more

  3. Now its week 4, you have 750k-1mil troops. Consider teaming up with another team in your position. Now you have 1.5-2mil troops.

  4. Find an undefended level 2 zone, close to a pvp event.

  5. Make sure the team is offline mostly when you attack, and execute well.

  6. Congratulations you have land, and a garrison bubble, and a pvp bubble.

Drop me a PM, I’ll help you through it


I was added in as part of the last Sapphire 2 batch.

It’s probably not a strength issue. Its probably a knowledge gap. But i’ve read a lot about it and i don’t see the way out. There are a million nuances that I haven’t seen written down anywhere. If I’m having trouble, how are others supposed to figure it out?


Have you tried talking to/working with more established teams. What knowledge are you specifically feeling short on? I can say from having participated since the start of beta, you have as much knowledge us anyone when new parameters come out. If you took someone from the beginning and just dropped them into this iteration they would have no clue what they were doing either.


Honestly I’m trying to measure my situation before I make any decisions for my team. Also i don’t know any of the established folks, and I’m fairly sure there are too many people in my position and not enough of them.

I don’t really know where to start with but I’ve been trying to reach out to other teams in the same boat I’m in. For me it is really important I don’t turn a War game into a politics game.

I feel like the game really needs to formalize alliances.

But no, I haven’t spoken to anyone established beyond in the forums and 1 line group. I feel like the level of mechanics I’m looking for, people either don’t know or are protecting it as trade secrets.

I unfortunately don’t know what I don’t know. I’ve read a number of guides and they all seem to gloss over the actual multi-player War bit. My experience so far is that battle is always player vs player. I think a lot of things true in diamond are not true of sapphire, and as such it’s hard to know what is really feasible when participation may be limited to 1/5th of the team at any given point.

Other games I’ve played have a concept of a rally, but we don’t seem to have that here. I honestly am not sure what role my small players can have in any battle other than to use a rusher with trapping. Their troops wouldn’t really contribute much as everyone big enough to back them up will be busy directly engaging.

If it turns out only the big guys can really help in the battle, then maybe it is a strength issue as our team is more balanced and less too heavy. (I assume the 500k troops constantly referenced is 50 * 10k but if smaller players troops aren’t really usedful then maybe I really need to target 100k per big player)

I also think the game is constantly changing. I could have sworn my rusher was immune to being delayed, but when I used him last night he became delayed for hours. I also thought his trap lasted longer than a single battle, but It’s just over a minute.

People keep talking about teams being offline, but I’ve not once found a piece of land without 24/7 defenders. (My team won’t be defending 24/7)

I see reference to using then pvp bubbles and yeah I keep forgetting about that, but those may be gone now.

I wish there was an example video of a real battle taking place. Or a detailed thought process for the parts of battle that keep getting glossed over.


Alliances DO need to be formalized and balance is definitely still off. Right now larger teams have no real incentive to fight each other so they tend to just go for smaller ones (hopefully this changes soon).

As far as what you know and can learn. Learn by doing honestly. Avoid maybe the upper echelon teams and have smaller engagements. Part of the reasons teams probably protect what they learn is because the cost it took to learn it was often very steep.

Small players and their interaction is probably a relative statement. If you want a level 100 to clear a 500 or defend against one…that is a bit unrealistic. It is probably more about picking and choosing your target in where and how you choose to test things out?

I do think and I have advocated this a lot, teams need better defense in most cases…the ability to get steamrolled is probably too easy. But we will see where it goes I guess.


Yes this I agree with fully. The bottom has nothing to compete with and the top is going to get boring real quick. I see this primarch as a giant step in that direction.

Yes and that has been the most useful. More so than the tutorials I’ve read even. I was trying to build troops up, but i honestly think I’ll learn more faster to just kill off 50k in the sake of learning. I also find the event prizes are too good to just not participate. I’ve gotten my noctua rider to 20 and it feels like a ridiculous improvement already.

Yes and I mostly have but I also feel it is necessary to understand what the controls are. In other games I can usually successfully play guerrilla warfare with the top teams, and band together with similarly minded. I feel I need to explore that, but I don’t want to disinterest my entire team in atlas from an experiment gone wrong. I also don’t want to be motivated by fear.

I suspect you hit the nail on the head, but I don’t think that is best for the game. At least not it it’s current form.

Well, we shouldn’t use levels here because it’s really dragons vs towers, so yes it can be a level 150 vs a 500 with a poorly designed base and skilled dragon usage. Honestly I’ve been surprised by how tough bases have been at my level (I’m a level 329 with 416m def and about to get my first mythic obsidian, my top dragons are noctua and necryx). I regularly take out level 400-500 bases without trouble. Sometimes even defended. In atlas because the base owner is often the defender, and the new layout, and just I think stronger desire to win due to troop loss, I often fall flat with similarly sized bases.

Anyways my point is that I’d like to level the field so I could get similar sized bases (and someone can get mine. It seems trivially easy to defend even compared to War defends)

But I think it would be great for my level 100s to do more than decoy attacks and trapping primarchs. Even if this only allowed 10% debuff, I could see it being a hugh step in the right direction.

I think we actually do rather well for our bracket, but we have some coverage gaps. Depending on how many attacks we are getting, i wouldn’t necessarily think it was a healthy game-life balance to try and catch all defends.

My big issue right now is as you said, no incentive to find someone on the same bracket, and there is no bracket below the bottom. I can’t attack down and attacking across is fierce.


Getting back to the proposal here, I am not adverse in theory but I share many of the concerns Gox expressed about the stacking and ultimate effect. I am resolutely opposed to any suggestion that a level 100 with Kinnarus should be able to solo D87 with enough slimers present, or even turn D87 into the equivalent of the invader base. This effect needs to be capped at some reasonable level so that base investments, flying skill and dragons are not made utterly irrelevant. Any change which lessens the need to fly well or that negates main game investments should be done with a light hand to say the very least.

This is a very valuable benefit–and it should have some drawback aside from garbage fighting stats I think. Maybe the slimer doesn’t have pinpoint accuracy much like its namesake, and some effluvia is discharged on to its own attacking fleet, causing those ships who benefit from slimer to also incur heavier troop losses on counterattacks. So there is more strategy involved than “bring as many slimers as possible”; instead perhaps “don’t bring a jackhammer when a scalpel will do”. Just a thought.

Furthermore, I would like to see any slimer concept only as part of a holistic balancing pass. In particular:

  1. I don’t think it’s equitable to allow the sort of attack Gox outlined by teams that are wholly protected by the neutral zone. PvP flags must be turned on for NZ attackers for fairness.

  2. All of the abusive 1 troop/ de minimus troop “tactics” must be fixed or normalized so that, for example, 5 troop primarchs are not just as good as full prims in terms of ability to attack garrisons.

  3. Limiting in some respect the ability of purchased troops to dictate outcomes, either by bounding the number of new troops that can be purchased weekly to a reasonable multiple of the free build rate, limiting total weekly revives or some combination thereof. The scaling costs work great for 99% of the playerbase but the last 1% should be limited in some respect for fair competition much like this proposal seeks to do with higher bases for lower level teams.


Yes, it would stack if multiple teammates slime. If you’re trying to defend against a very high level aggressor, then many slimes might be necessary. I’m not too worried about someone creating new accounts to get more slimes though … slime, like a rusher’s trap, is a short-lived effect and creating new accounts won’t be an effective way to slime (you have to play through the tutorial, unlock the new primarch, summon it, get it to the target, etc.).


:thinking: Is there not going to be a cap on the slime effect then? I had read through it assuming there would be.

If this were to go onto an L5+ fighter, will the piece get a recolor?


I’m not sure re cap, @forScience – I think we’d have to play and see what feels right. Maybe the cap should be a percentage of the target’s level (e.g., you can only reduce a base to half it’s level, or whatever threshold seems right). I like the recolor!


Why is everyone thinking this only benefits the small guy hitting the big guy… on the flipside this primarch just makes the big guy “bigger”. What’s stopping a level 500 using this primarch on a base garrisoned by 100s?

I don’t think this mechanic is enough to balance things out. You can say the “smaller” team needs to build enough forces and coordinate their attacks… this works for the “big” teams as well. This just adds another complexity that is not needed now, maybe later.


It seems like bigger players wouldn’t necessarily need the debuff – if their dragons are strong enough, they can attack without it.


Correct but it doesn’t stop them from using it for an even easier time steamrollering smaller teams.

does not mean they really won’t (even though it may not be good strategy to do so)… just sayin’ :man_shrugging:


Doesn’t make much sense. If they can 5 flame the base with or without it means there is no reason to bring it. Additionally the buff is dependent upon how many troops the primarch has. Given this primarch has weak stats they would be bringing in lots of troops on a weak primarch at risk of dying for no reason.


From a personal point of view and considering my level and dragons, I should find this debuff primarch amazing to weaken the higher bases.

But from a balanced game point of view I’m totally against this.
Primarchs can attack, defend, trap or debuff other primarchs or forts. They strongly influence the outcome of troop losses and nothing more.

When we attack in Atlas, our dragons and bases should have the same strength as they have in the core game. No new primarch ability or whatsoever should change or devalue anything the players have built over months and years!

You already messed up our tower placements and perches with the Atlas base UI, we really don’t need weaker dragons or weaker bases just because a bunch of players are using some new primarch type.

I liked the other primarch ideas much more, like AoE damage to troops. Let’s keep it on the Atlas and troop level and let players rely on the dragons and bases they built/bred.


Anything that drops the value or a base by say $10 000 wouldn’t exactly be the smartest business decision.

Why would a player spend say $10k to go from 300–> 400 if you simply deactivate it with a level hundred pressing a button?


Totally second the last two posts.

Plus it would be used to weaken the only anchor base on a small team to steamroll it.

Also good built high level bases don’t fall properly defended. With that prim they would and ppl lose again months of ships built (let’s say a maxed taunter with 150k troops on a lv 380).

It must be nerfed. The weakening ends when you kill it.

Otherwise they would come with some high level Taunters who protect that slimer and would kill everyone.


Well, taunters can be countered – trap them or slime and kill them. There’s counterplay there.

@Gox1201@MareZ Is it really dropping the value of the base? I’m not so sure. People built up strong bases for many reasons, but most existed before Atlas. By giving strong bases relative immunity from smaller but perhaps more active teams bases would be worth even more – slimers just pare that back down so that teamwork can overcome some obstacles.

We could also take this in another direction – perhaps the slime could buff instead and you would target it onto an ally and their dragons would get an attack & hp boost. In some ways this might have more counterplay in that the aggressed could end the threat by taking out the boosted target.


So to get this straight you can get the slimers too right and kill them without allowing them to enable their special ability?

If so we will trap those slimers with rushers… problem solved


One thing that shouldn’t be discounted is the risk it is to use slimers when attacking an enemy force.
Some important notes are as follows:

  • Remember one slimer de-buff alone isn’t likely to make much of a difference.
  • To get the full benefit of the de-buff the slimer must have its max carrying capacity of troops.
  • Its atk and def stats will be weak so if it gets caught in a blockade it will likely die immediately
  • Players have to be willing to send in multiple slimers, that all are at risk of losing decent amounts of troops just to take one one target.
  • On defense they are a much stronger play, as the wont be stuck at a location due to a blockade most likely.