Death of this War Dragons


#263

I’ve seen plenty of players and clans that are there for the rewards. They collect tribute, run XP on beasts, and keep the minimum level troops parked on defense. Zero appetite for defending allies, going on bubble runs, or even NML. They might complete a line, sometimes. Bet that describes a whole LOT of players at the end of the day.


#264

From a pure glory farming perspective, I don’t begrudge anyone from dropping down given the current mechanics. I do believe that in doing so a team effectively caps themselves. The caps of particular concern are Gold, Shards and Troop training. The latter two having significant impact on the individual player.

But let’s keep it at GP farming… Troops are king. If you don’t have them then you aren’t doing much GP farming. If your infrastructure doesn’t support getting troops at a good clip then you’re forced to spend to get them. That would wear thin pretty quickly.

In a round about way, I’d say we capped ourselves early on by taking a methodical approach to our infrastructure when we first came to Atlas. But that approach has paid huge dividends. If a team has realized that they stretched themselves too thin and dropping castles to rectify the situation then by all means go for it.

The example I used in my original post was about a team that was dropping purely for easier glory. In that scenario, it’s extremely short sighted. Again, my opinion which at the end of the day doesn’t mean bupkis. :grin:


#265

Yea the policing would be tough. Main game incentives would need to be worth keeping teams from sandbagging. Or cancel the lock I proposed so if a Sapphire team reaches D2 somebody will need to be traded or cut. Sandbagging will always be a problem so maybe that needs to be addressed before anything?


#266

I deff get what your saying here about people wanting the new space, but people seem to bitch when they got it and bitxh when they dont. Maybe by giving the big teams there own area like it originally started out as and giving the smaller teams an area that offers same type of rewards just not as much would make everyone happy. However we are talking about the war dragons community and we are never truly happy with anything for long. :joy::joy::joy:


#267

Proof?
Ohhh you mean Big bad Diamond teams bullying lower lvl teams like this? Or is it just a simple glory exchange? Funny, I don’t see the alliance everyone is crying about bullying actually here. I do however see many of the teams that are complaining about tactics used by others being employed here. Irony or hypocrisy?

Point is, everyone does it, it’s part of the game. Some just do it better than others.


#268

Oh my god look at all those troops! That’s insane how many troops are there. Somebody call the bully police because there’s almost 150k troops on one castle. Big brutes should go pick on somebody else!

And flagged in 3… 2… 1…


#269

And I thought we’d moved beyond that portion of the thread; not particularly constructive imho. But. Something worth noting is that the team who owns the castle is S1. I mentioned this briefly somewhere or other, but there’s a lot of variation within and between leagues/sub-leagues. The top of diamond is not the same as the bottom of diamond (I’d venture to say the top of D1 is not the same as the bottom of D1 even). What’s OP is relative. So how are we defining “bullying” in that context?

The question is relevant to me because some of the suggestions have been to separate diamond and sapphire from the rest. But I was in Atlas when it was mostly diamond and S1. The small teams were the S1 teams (it is my personal and therefore possibly wrong opinion that most S1 teams are closer to P1 teams than they are to D1 teams, relatively speaking). Atlas functioned no differently, really, just on a smaller scale. So where is the line? Is it “bullying” just because it’s a lot of teams? Is it bullying because there are diamond teams (of whatever sub-league) there? Does the motivation of the teams being there matter (easy glory, eviction, etc.)?


#270

Oh I totally agree here. The game needs to make a profit, but owners who look at profit margins in the short term may be very well killing the horse they are riding in the mid-long term.


#271

I think this is where the ‘never-ending-battle’ of atlas becomes a means of seemingly bullying behaviour even if that is not the intent of the individual player or team. Your 2 hits, your teams 8 hits may seem negligible, but if yours are followed by teams x, y, z and a, b, c, not to mention d, e, j and l. The collective result is that not just your lunch money is stolen, but your bag, shirt, shoes, and bus money too. :woman_shrugging:


#272

The point was that everyone practices the same tactics to some extent. Yet some still come here to protest it when said tactic is used against them. Proof was requested & proof was provided. Simple as that.


#273

Some of what you might think is bullying is just a result of the meat shields sponsors put in place.

Imagine glory hungry D1-D2 acting foolishly (glory sniping 24 X 7 on just one castle) and when the other clan has enough and cuts through your T2s to bubble the offending team in retaliation or even attempts to secure a foot hold castle to return this type of easy entry sniping.

The little plat teams that agreed to be shields end up here butt hurt and surprised when they know full well what was required when they accepted those “free” T2s. A S1 team on your T2 castle is terrible glory and I bet there is a bigger story.

What I’m saying is that if you signed up to be a speed bump, you can’t cry foul when you get run over. :joy:


#274

I get the intent of it, but that is just trying to carry teams into situations they really shouldnt be in…which is part of the problems now right? This is just a formalized version but the same issues of disparity will remain.

Not sure what this means?

Right but part of that is you entered into a battle that you seem to freely admit you are not equipped for? Nobody forced you to, so if you chose to, why?

I still think a lot of it is tied into the general dynamics, how things are achieved and tbh unrealistic expectations on the part of some.


#275

What these plat teams should keep in mind is that being small doesn’t mean shit. People notice who shows up constantly and sticks their nose where it doesn’t belong . People don’t forget that stuff. It dosent just go away because the raid is done. Nope. If a Diamond team dosent retaliate against them, it will be a sapphire team. Somebody will get revenge :slightly_smiling_face: you don’t get a free no-hit pass to show up anywhere u like because your small or in platinum.
If you don’t want to fight the big teams, don’t get involved in big battles.


#276

A lot of it I think still comes down to greater tiering needed…for example. Right now level 4s are some of the biggest example of things being too close. They give enough rewards that people want them and then you saw teams from plat to diamond all in the same area. There are essentially 4 levels of islands and given the gap between the top and the bottom you need more than that…and you need them to be a significantly different value so you dont have groups at hugely different performance fighting over the same things.

I could be wrong but what I think I see a lot of is people want to tie rewards to people fighting their “equals” and then having the return be the same for them as it would be for the top team based on what they call being competitive.

Right, so you dont match high school teams against professional teams. Totally, people fight in their bracket. But high school players also dont get paid like the ones at the summit of the that same sport either. Thats the issue that I see, people want to win at the high school level and then be rewarded like they are world champions, its not the same thing…sorry.

People want a greater divide honestly, there probably should be, but like all things, it cant just be the benefits alone.

Looking at the number of teams that “help” each other, Im curious how they thought that was going to work. Often help is a two way street, when they accepted the benefits they also accepted being willing to fight their benefactors battles. Now that they are losing that battle, they dont like it. Im not really sure how they expected that to go and I could very well be missing a dynamic in there as well.


#277

You seem to continually be misguided or deliberately prevaricating that we are talking about interfering in others battles.
I am talking about protecting my home, with myself, and my fiveTA.
Your comments are disingenuous.


#278

How is that the fault of any of the top teams? What I do t understand is that everyone has the same opportunity to be good or great… find the right people… people that are willing to put the work in to make it up the leagues and gain atlas… then build their bases and win win events and move up… then take over castles and so on… what i’m hearing here mostly is people wanting “free handouts” or for PG to make their lives easier as opposed to actually working and earning a top position.

The mechanics are the same for every team… every new team starts off in Bronze and has to work it’s way up… every player starts off level 1 and has to build their base and breed/train their dragons… So I fail to understand the argument that the game or its mechanics are in any way favoring anyone.

Teams just have to actually work at improving their rankings and help themselves get better.


#279

Im talking about when you did though. That you want to gloss over, the starting point for some of the aggression was because you continually showed up to defend a team that was NOT in your 5TA and wasnt at your home. As far as I can tell, they helped you gain land in exchange for your assistance. Nothing wrong with that, but if you ally with someone, sometimes you inherit their conflicts as well. By doing so, you brought all assets into a conflict.

Just saying this is a perfect example of wanting things but only in the manner and conditions that benefit you. The reason those might have been targeted in the first place is because of actions you took previously so feigning ignorance and making it sound like you had no part in something and you are simply trying to protect your home is irrelevant. Because said home was gained in part due to an allegiance you gave.

Anyhow, my point being…to some degree you reap what you sow, Atlas definitely needs changes to dynamics but all facets need to be considered. Playing the victim card and saying you are randomly being attacked is just trying to skew the facts. I fully admit that it is a fight you are not able to handle, but what I have been trying to ascertain is, if you were not,then why do it? But if you want to hide from it and paint a different picture, then it would make resolution even harder since you want things to work off of a broken information basis.

In any case…increased segmentation would hopefully address some of your issues but like all things, if you want to fight someone at a higher level, you should probably game plan for the possibility you might lose.


#280

And I come back to the original point of my post. It is not about me and my castles nor my fiveTA nor my wider alliance. It is about the future of the game where one side is controlling the board - with no end in sight.

How many chess games are won by a player who has had most of their pieces and strategic positions eliminated?

What game is left except to dodge the final blow for a few moves?

All credit to the victor but let the game reset and the challenge begin again. Even if the outcome is the same, each match uses different opening moves and counter moves, each match is its own pleasure.


#281

Not sure why you keep using chess? In a lot of ways it has very few ties to what Atlas is…other than in a sense it is what you want it to be. Chess would be a good example of a truely skill based game with little outside influence. You cannot purchase better pieces and the only way to upgrade is through very specific conditions. Almost none of that applies to this app so…not really sure how you keep trying to make these parallels.

You keep saying this should be like a chess game? But should it? Plus, chess is also decided generally by a series of conditions being met…what you are suggesting sounds timed based.

I mean…as far as I can tell, youre just pushing for a reset because you think it will help your position. Nothing wrong with that, but it would just make sense to use a bit more applicable logic to it.


#282

Look, I’m not entitled enough to say they shouldn’t come. In the same breath, it shouldn’t be a surprise if there is retaliation. That’s all I’m saying. There’s plenty of teams out there that have been doing their own thing without much worry of some beast rolling them over.

There’s not many Diamond teams that actively romp smaller teams without reason, the juice isn’t worth the squeeze. But if they jump in the fight, punches are bound to be thrown. It’s just common sense.

And one side complaining that the other does something that they do themselves, all the while executing it with a propaganda campaign filled with mis information and false truths in some lame attempt to paint themselves as the innocent victim, well that’s just asinine hypocrisy at its best enough to trigger even half a logical brain such as mine.

It just seems that ppl read too much into it, Atlas is a global map and battles are bound to happen. Doesn’t matter what league, team, or affiliation your about. It’s the game. You’re gonna have to deal with it until you either quit or they pull the plug. It’s just that simple.

Good debate, see you in the game.