Feedback for First rough draft of World War


#1

Meh, I can see value on both sides of the argument for this.

Elaborate on this, because at the moment it feels like a placeholder title for the war idol to fight for. Are these tokens usable by team members? Do team members have to pay into the cache? If so are you making players choose between new dragons and team wars and progression?

Pick your sides people of diamond 1, NMO or Dreadnaught, with 10 teams per team, 20 teams total, you will have Diamond 1 in perpetual war between these two factions.

New war model, ok fine, you’re modifying the original game, evolving a game is fine if done right i guess, wont please everybody but don’t piss people off and destroy your community in the process of trying to appease investors. Atlas does have potential for being a much bigger play ground with more to do, and more room for developers to mold and change to evolve the game for a long haul.

Elaborate on the specifics you have in mind

Good now diamond can’t just control everything and bully lower teams. Not sure it’ll work the way this is stated but the intention is good.

Ok was kind of inevitable

Interesting, but…FIX THE BALANCE BETWEEN THE OTHER CLASSES BEFORE YOU RELEASE A NEW CLASS OF DRAGON. Seriously don’t keep introducing new stuff while the old stuff is still unbalanced.

:neutral_face: :expressionless: :no_mouth: :disappointed: :confounded: :sob: :dizzy_face::face_with_symbols_over_mouth: :face_with_symbols_over_mouth: :face_with_symbols_over_mouth: :fu: :fu: :fu: :fu: :fu: :fu: :fu: :fu: :-1: :-1: :-1: :-1: :-1: :-1: :-1: :-1: :-1: :earth_americas::fire: :bomb: :boom: :radioactive: :radioactive: :radioactive: :radioactive: :radioactive: :biohazard: :biohazard: :biohazard: :biohazard: :biohazard::biohazard: :biohazard: :biohazard:
To quote Red "NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NON, NIET, DE NADA, NOPE, NUH UH, NOOOOOOOOOOO, GOD NO, NO, NO NO NO NO.

Ok beyond the spazz a whole tier not only made exclusive to certain teams

But also exclusive to certain PEOPLE. I don’t even know what to call this B*******, pay to win is one thing, but somehow, to my amazement you’ve managed to create a whole new class of rigged gameplay. Are you trying to see if you can take the title of worst anti-consumer policies away from EA? Trying to put yourself in the running are you?
On top of that, either this new tier will bypass the current tiers potentially making the original breeding irrelevant, OR its a tier beyond Obsidian. If it’s the ladder then you have to have your main breeding done before you can even use said prizes, and said prizes will cause even further issues. For example if you don’t release new tower levels to match them, then oohhh my we have literally an UNSTOPPABLE DRAGON, and if you DO release new tower tiers, OH SHIT there’s bases out there that CAN ONLY be beat by these specific players and NO ONE ELSE.

Finally vanity prizes

Speed=pointless now, speed boosters=pointless, choke points=pointless, alliances=pointless, trappers=pointless

Sigh, So basically atlas lets you opt out of the base game

Whats the point of even calling them tokens. If we cant spend them, then their point is completely different. if we can spend them then we have to make decisions on what we want to do, world wars vs new dragons. Do we have to contribute from our token stash? Does the fort produce tokens that gets sent to the community fund anyway(making it pointless to call it tokens)? So many questions on this massive part that you’re just glossing over like its no big deal, big clarification is needed.

Seriously how token rich do you think people are??? With people complaining about a sapphire wall of 600k tokens to clear the tier, and you want to institute a 100k token war prerequisite. Seriously what are you people smoking in that office(share please)???

Lets do the math for everyone shall we. 20 Teams, 20*4=80, 80+base(36)=116h. Translation a 5 DAY WAR!

Incentive to burn through everything you have because losing is a big loss;buuuuuuutttttt…WINNING IS A BIG COST TOO

Big Incentive not to lose

Even if the contribution isn’t even
But alas I digress, the main issue I see is you’ll get one BIG WAR, then poof everyone is SOL. Either you put everything you have into the war, or you risk losing a shit ton of tokens and league points. But even if you do win, your forces are DEPLETED, meaning ALL your land is now in jeopardy, lets say all of diamond 1 dives into an all out war with each other, and puts everything they have into it; oh here comes Diamond 2 to clean house, take land and screw over everyone who participated. Or Diamond 1 is forced to BUY massive amounts of troops to counter this. But this is just a war of attrition, not just of troops, but of allies, tokens, and real world cash.
All I see is a blood bath where no one wins, everyone loses and PG profits (Cough War profiteering Cough)

Evidence is speaking to the contrary, either own it and figure out how to do it right, or stop cramming base game features into atlas, and adding atlas features that undermine the base game.

So you cant spend, only contribute.

Agree, rant aside communication is good, even if the messenger is taking a few bullets.

Here here :+1:

Fix the existing imbalance between classes first.

Which will completely screw any sense of balance you could ever hope to achieve in a game.

DO IT!

Agree

DING DING DING we have the major factor that will screw everyone evenly.

Do you seriously expect a team to remain the same for what 50 months? 50 seasons? 50 wars? With resentment, and a clear divide in player advantages you can’t be serious. Hell even 10 people at a time, 5 months? 5 seasons? 5 wars?

Then you need a full revamp on your thought process behind how to do this.

You don’t have to do war to take advantage of a blood ridden corpse post-war.

But you’ll still open the door for “ringer” teams to be created that can manipulate the outcomes of these wars, the same way you have “ringer” players in the existing war mechanics.

Ok I have to sleep now so (part 1 of (no idea how bad this is going to get))


#2

Thanks for finding a place to share your thoughts. I would’ve hated to missed out on all this!

Re token caches – tokens will accrue into the cache based on how much infrastructure you have. Players will not be donating their own tokens to it, so there’s no need (or ability) to choose between new dragons and world wars.

Re sides – It’s hard to tell how often those two will fight. To some extent, they will be limited by their treasuries, just like everyone else … because even as a team which joins a war, ante is required. Also, top teams like Dreadnought can’t join any old war – they can only join if the war would remain within competitive boundaries after they joined (e.g., a war between platinum teams would definitely not support inviting DN).

Re Fort combat bonus – we’ll add +300% to the fort bonus across the board. It can still be negated by siegers, but a lone attacker will incur heavy losses if they try to take out a team on their own.

Re new dragon type – Ok. The thought was something fresh would be especially fun. But we can stick to well-trodden ground if that’s the preference; certainly easier.

Re unlock entire tiers – I have to say, I was taken aback that players were so opposed to this. I’d love to get a tier boost personally. I don’t quite understand why it attracts such a passionate response yet, but I do get the message.

Re choosing players – This has already been taken out of the proposal based on community feedback.

Re trappers=pointless – I can’t agree with you here. Trappers stop enemies from moving (or flying) and prevent them from using their abilities (active or passive). That’s still an incredible ability; one of the most versatile!

Re opt out of war – Players only have time to do so much. World War builds on war, and I wanted to give teams an option to focus their time on this new feature if they so chose. This is a contentious point, and one far from decided. Right now I’m focusing on smaller, fundamental changes in some other topics. We’ll come back to this latter (or maybe it’ll fade away from consideration altogether).

Re tribute tokens – No you do not contribute them from your personal stash. The fort produces tokens that get sent to the community fund. Calling them tokens seems appropriate since when you ante and then win them they get distributed to your team. I’m not sure why we’d call them something else since players are fighting over and ultimately receive tokens.

Re 100k tokens – This is a teamwide ante. You don’t need to spend – these are free tokens that accrue merely for owning land in Atlas (even a single piece, which more than 75% of teams do … and hopefully with the upkeep changes that number will get much closer to 100%).


Atlas Feedback from non Atlas players aka Don’t look here PG
#3

Because most of us are officers or have been officers and we know how this will play out. No one likes to be the one to say one person can have this but everyone else can’t. How do you justify that?


#4

Gotcha, I definitely grokked the feedback around not wanting to have to choose on person to get a prize for. I thought there might be additional reasons as to why the opposition to dragon tiers was so hefty, but it would totally make sense if this was the dominant reason players didn’t like it.


#5

Breeding dragons and levelling them is a fundamental part of the game. Giving them away in rewards just feel wrong. And I say this even as I’m right up against the sapphire wall currently. Would I love to be able to vault the wall in one go? Absolutely. Would it be fair? Probably not.


#6

Well the other reasons is they’re coming out too frequently now. Building a good base of dragons was fine, but it’s time to slow down to 1 per 6 months, not one every 3 or 4 months. Take your time make quality dragons that leave us in awe and enjoy the quality of the kit. But also the way the tier was presented was access to it being season exclusive.


#7

I see that you want to change up the game and make wars more interesting…but I don’t think this is the way to do it. I see it changing the game fundamentally, and I think it’s a bad idea.


#8

@PGDave

So they get the excess tokens beyond the team cap?

Don’t misunderstand, I’m VERY fascinated by a new class and think it would be awesome. But the practical thoughts in my head say that balance should come to the primary structure first. When in the balance changes we thought that an attack speed buff might be coming it was awesome because many in the community thought it might close the gap between the classes.
But it wasn’t the case; but how about this, the hunters identity is a precision fighter and his attack pattern models it you can double finger 1 tower, 3 tap 3 towers, or hammer down one tower, or spread around the shots, there’s a lot of variety associated with their identity.
How about for warriors as their purpose is suppose to be the meaty beef cake thats suppose to just tank everything and plow though; maybe give that class a meter that as it attacks it builds up passive damage reduction that falls off in between islands, the percentage can be molded for balance, and it would give a specific attribute within the class you can easily control for general class balance.
Meanwhile give sorcerers a meter that as they attack, it builds up a free spell meter, tying into their identity as casters, while not paralyzing them if they have no rage, their slow attacks are at least still building towards something. The rate at which the meter builds off of the attacks can be easily controlled and balanced for cross class balance, and it gives sorcerers a unique trait that feeds into their identity
In this way each class would have a unique identifying trait, that is also easily tweaked to give balance between classes. Hunters you could change the recharge rate/max energy for their powerful precision shots. Warriors would get a bit of damage reduction to help tank and plow through an island(their damage still being low means theyre not supposed to clear an island, just plow over it, maybe maybe taking out a couple targets, and draining the enemy resources in the process(like super shots); and the value can easily be modified. While sorcerers would have a way of making an opening shot against islands even if their rage has taken a serious hit meaning they would no longer be sitting ducks waiting for rage to return; and again an easily controllable factor to balance the classes.

Maybe rather than say “we can opt out, or disable wars” instead say “while an atlas world war is taking place normal wars can not be declared, or be declared upon; and vise versa for main game wars”

I said this because if a flier is able to move super fast across a land the odds of you catching him and trapping him are slim, the only way you would, is if hes intentionally laying himself out as bait, to draw patriarchs away from a castle, or hes being an idiot.

Its not the new tier per say, its a combination of the frequency and the season specific nature of the tier you described. Meaning lower players could never get their hands on those dragons and would be permanently at a disadvantage. i.e.: imagine to get obsidian ranking you had to get 12 obsidian research eggs that were locked behind a season mythic dragon. Now imagine the only way to get the sigils for that season line, weren’t even accessible to 50% of the players(gold and below, random guess)


#9

:woman_facepalming: Dave already locked the thread to focus feedback on smaller and more foundational areas. Give your feedback on those?


#10

I was unable to put my point across to the original thread - so want to put my objections forward. These changes wil fundamentally change the entire game. Don’t want to war? We’ll opt out - essentially affecting league structure. Teams to choose who the prize goes to? Teams are families in the most and 9 times out of 10 would want it split equally. Flying primarchs? Many teams have spent vast amount of time and money gaining land in atlas and fortifying it. This will make all of it this time and effort redundant. In short, I really think this is an awful idea.


#11

I was largely opposed as well, but Dave withdrew the proposal in favor of tackling issues step by step, so check the links FS posted above and join the convo there so it’s all in one place.


#12

@PGDave
Why not just give team that falls Into that rank discount for that tier of dragon.
For example if you are in rank 9 (highest), give 50% (or whatever % PG wants) token discount for the entire team in obsidian or whatever tier comes next?
Doing this way will solve the Sapphire wall as well


#13

Very interesting.


#14

(thread closed b/c everyone has had a chance to weigh in on the original proposal now … and as others have suggested we’re dissecting and discussing the (many) proposals in smaller chunks now).


#15

Yes

There are some awesome ideas here. I love thinking about how to strengthen the identity of each class of dragons (and making them all equally viable at the same time). Would you mind reposting your identity thoughts in the suggestions forum? I’d be great to get this in front of more players (including many who probably haven’t read this thread because they didn’t know this gem who in here ;)).

That’s a nice compromise idea. When we get back to World War discussions, this idea will be very much worth further discussion.