In game towers, rebalance


#1

Well,
Most of us that have fire turret, regret getting one. Main reason? It fires extremely slow. Slight good for low level bases, where the main dragons are slower warriors, but high level bases, with hunters? No go.
Together with the new towers levels coming up, why not allow us to also enjoy the fire turrets?
Currently it fires 0.33 times per second, while archer 1.2 and cannon 0.67.
Please increase the fire cadency to at least the same as cannon, this way we can make use of the tons of fire shards we have.


#2

Fire turrets definitely need something. There’s no point in building them in their current state. Certainly not on a higher level base in my opinion.

I’d prefer if the main attack was the beam and the fireball was special attack.


#3

then no one will waste Supershots on the Fire Turrets


#4

Fire turrets (even regular attack) need to burst through shields or some shit at this point just like a cannon supershot because they are one of my least favorite towers, right after ballistas. I hardly ever worry about them unless i’m hitting out of my comfort zone and they are too high a level for my dragon. And then i seem to just be cautiously aware of them.


#5

Since you’re already talking about archers and cannons, which are both superior as-is to fire turrets, mind adding the latter to the mix? It is arguably the worst tower save the ballista, and it takes semi-premium currency to build and level it, to boot.

@PGJared @Arelyna


#6

My suggestion on improving fire turret.

  1. Make normal attack purely a projectile attack, not being preventable with elemental barrier.
  2. Make the increase in dragon’s damage taken a default, not only for super shots.
  3. Make it so that supershot will recharge automatically for fire turrets
    These changes will make fire turret to be either a projectile or elemental tower depending on defenders choice, without limitation. With high attack power, this I think will make it more useful :slight_smile:

#7

Fat chance.


#8

Another option is maybe making the fire pass through shields except for elemental or invincible shields that are specifically designed to block elements or all damages. Any shield who are designed to block damage would block more or less damages from fire.

Examples :

  • Stone Shield could still absorb as much damage from the beam as his reduced % shows because stone is a good isolation from heat. That’s not as if people liked to use stone shield anyway…
  • Heat Shield (or its little sibling) could block more damage from fire turrets than other towers, as the name suggests (I want more love for Heat shield :grin: please)
  • Explosive Shield should be scattered and damage the Dragon a little if touched by any fireball turret attack, even if the attack doesn’t do enough damage to normally trigger the explosion. Like throwing a lighted match in an explosive powder storage (you better be a good runner if you try btw :laughing:)

There are other more recent shields, but you get my point, sometimes fire turret attack breaks the shield, sometimes it passes through it dealing damage, sometimes nothing changes. And there are other types of damage protection that are no shields and could be more or less affected by the beam or the fireball…

Just ideas I had based on heat and elements, I didn’t think much about the impact on the metagame (like Explosive Shield is unlikely to be useful for high tier lol) and I just let my imagination go wild. Please don’t consider it as definitive ideas, just a fun guideline of what could be and will never be because it would be a pain to code, not even mentioning players would complain that fire turrets hurt more than they should/broke shield/explosive shield doesn’t work…


#9

not sure about this… only in lvl40ish Region with firetower.

BUT

lets take a stormtower for instance: the damage it deals is shit but it is great with supershot for the shield.
I see it similar with the firetower. It is kinda crap but when defending a base and using supershot it does remarkable damage.

So I can´t see the problem atm or is it simply getting worse in higher levels?


#10

worse at higher levels. Especially since nearly all high level dragons can avoid it easily.


#11

Thanks for the thoughtful points brought up here. It sounds like it’s a mix of scaling and balance that could be tuned. I’ve gotten the eyes of some of our designers on this for their assessment.


#12

Thanks @PGEggToken. Can I also chuck in a request to look at archer and cannons since the recent code change to roll back some research errors? They seem to be underpowered now.

Thanks!


#13

I really like this discussion. Thanks for starting this thread.

Actually Fire Turret holds pretty good value for the cost already in terms of damage output.

The real problem right now seems to be - especially for higher level bases, Hunter dragons are too efficient as a meta. Other than fire turrets(which are actually not the greatest counter to Hunters), did you think about how we can make certain other towers good against Hunters?


#14

If I may add a little more of my imagination today, what if trebuchets or storm towers had a chance to send back Hunter fireballs, to make the Dragon taste their own medicine… I suppose that the future iceflak may slow down the Dragon fireballs rate or ammo regenerated, or this ability could be added to ice turrets…

(Still just wildly throwing ideas as you asked for it @PGPulse but I don’t know how it would affect the metagame, I trust my elders in War Dragons to sort the good ideas out of mine, if there are some :wink:)


#15

They need to be more dynamic. That why ice turret is so effective, and the others, only hen protected by storm or hammer falling


#16

I’m glad you asked… I had an idea that would stop the usefulness of hunters as well as sorcerer(to an extent). This is over the (hopefully) upcoming Ice Flak Tower!!! Since Fire Towers increase damage to dragons and Fire Flaks Reduce the dragons’ attack, why not apply this to the idea Ice towers and Ice Flaks? Seeing how hunters depend on precision and control why not make a tower that can hurt the dragon? Ice Flaks would be designed to mirror the attack of the dragon that hits it (this only affects the bolts of hunter and sorcerer dragons as warriors use flames). In other words, the Ice Flak’s SuperShot would induce a mirror effect upon the incoming bolts of fire or throwable spells(bomb-like spells such as fireball, frozen tomb, earthquake, and deathgaze) meaning: when it is hit by attacks of this nature its Super Shot would be a Icy Shield that shatters and damages dragons that use those specific attacks. The shield could either be cast upon the surrounding towers allowing the tower immunity to one single hit (and damaging the attacking dragon upon breaking as long as it is a bomb-like attack) OR shield itself and take certain number of hits to break it(same idea as crystalline shield like on frost, snowdrop, and Icicle). I just thought of another one… ORRRRR it could cast two random icy shields upon random surrounding towers and would give those towers the immunity i talked about in the previous sentence!!!

Am I drooling…? Sorry, i got excited for a sec there… I hope these ideas might spur some of your own, and please consider this ET!!!


#17

Some ideas for you Pulse other than the ones above:

  • Archer and cannon fire rate to go up - they should be faster than elemental towers to balance out the lower damage dealt per shot
  • [WD community don’t kill me - I love hunters!!] Cloak won’t dodge elemental attacks
  • Give a HP buff to Storm, similar to how mage towers can have 30% HP buff with research - that will make it a more attractive choice for defensive tower as dragons are forced to take it out to remove its super shot effect

#18

Nice idea! Warriors will be needed to take out Ice Flaks… it would sort of shake up the meta at the least.


#19

As a hunter lover, I would like to say big NO for a tower specifically targeting hunters.
I mean flying hunters requires more skill and planning compared to others so, why not give a credit to people who practiced them.
Meanwhile I think the problem for non hunter lovers is that warriors are kind of nerfed compared to others, especially above gold tier. But I think PG has done a good job on divines after Sage, since they all look decent.


#20

I respectfully disagree. For the glacial pace of the wind up and firing on the default attack, I would expect it to hit very hard on a dragon with no mitigation. And on the early and mid levels it does. But at high level the damage is really bad in my opinion. It just pales in comparison to the ice tower.

Will give some more thought on the hunter meta