I’m in need of your expert advise. Thanks to you guys I’m well aware of the glory mechanics.
But, to be honest, I still have trouble to (quickly) identify targets that are worth to give it a shot. (I can’t get all the math and factors that are influencing the glory calculation into my head )
At the moment I’m following this rules of thumb:
I only Attack with Fighter/Destroyer or Sieger. Never with Trapper or Taunter. Those are only for defending
When defending I try to allow the attacker to kill approximately 60% for best glory. When I’m attacking, I try to get the 100% with 2 Dragons.
When selecting a target to attack, I look for glory percentages that is shown (circle menu on the left) 80%+, if the defender has at least 2.5k+ troops on his primarch (bottom right corner) and that the primarch is preferably a defending type (Taunter or Trapper)
Have you guys and further advice for me on this?
How are you evaluating your targets before attacking (glory wise)?
Always attack to 5 flame
Always defend to stop attacker asap. Prefably less than 10%
Where possible only hit 100% targets, you never need to hit lower than that unless per team decree.
Always try to hit lowest defense first, so siegers, then taunt/destroyer depending on level, then rusher
Wait, what? I thought I read elsewhere that if you defend and stop them with 10% or less you only get about 66% of the glory you should have? I thought it was over 10 but less than 100% to get 99% of possible glory.
Essentially, you get less glory for each attack (since you lose less troops), but in the long run it’s worth it since you didn’t lose many troops - better to build new troops than revive lost troops. Instead of losing lots of troops and getting capped at .75 GP per troop you killed, you lose very few troops and get 1.5x the GP per troop you lost. At the same time, the enemy takes a big loss. Win/win.
This is how to get the best kill ratio which maxes your glory per troop you lose. But it ignores enemy troops as a resource. I.E. it isn’t good for glory swapping but great for typical attacking guidelines.
Basically when you are seeking glory you can get at most 1.5 times your troops lost, and getting the best defense or offense (kill ratio) will always max at 1.5 times your losses
2:1 is the optimal kill for being most efficient on your troops and the enemy troops. If you have an endless supply of enemy troops you don’t have to care about this. If you are glory swapping you probably care. Typical attacks you just want to get 2:1 or better.
The amount of glory per troop you lose is constant. Yes you get less glory per attack if time is a concern. But no you don’t get less glory per troop your lose.
Here we are confusing glory and revives. Not related.
Glory is 75% of killed troops capped by 150% your losses and scaled for team and player. Aka minimum between the two.
Where TEAMSCALE Is a percent based on influence difference, and PLAYERSCALE is a percentage based on player level difference, and they are divided by two (averaged). You can find this number by using the calculator or display on primarch in game to find the overall percent (already averaged) that you need to multiply by
Revives are not tied to glory. Good battle determined by flames and percent killed gives you bad revives, and bad battles give you good revives. Minimum revive is 66.6% (2/3rds) and maximum revive is 100% on defense and 99% on attack. It’s possible to get 5 flames (bad revive) with bad glory (primarch attack and defense values). An example of bad revives and bad glory would be attacking a trapper with a trapper and getting 5 flames on the attack.
Yes in the earlier example you got less glory on the attack but lost less troops. So your glory is still good glory.
Gox also pointed out opportunity of revives. Even with less revives it’s better glory opportunity when you do well due to the revive cost combined with less lost troops. This opportunity is based on glory per your troops lost. It ignores enemy troops as a resource.
Atlas mechanics are freakin’ nuts. I just find a manageable target (in NML) for 100% glory, make sure they have a couple thousand or more troops loaded, and go in for the kill with my Destroyer. I can’t possibly keep track of all these workings Let me just read this thread three more times over…
All this is what I meant when I said glory was unintuitive and encouraged poor performance. Whether or not it’s actually better to do poorly in battle is a different matter but the fact remains that many people think it is
Typical 1:10 750 vs 7500, as the defender you get 1125 glory (1.5x your losses) That all sounds correct
Your recovery percent I think may be wrong here.
I think the ratio is basically like this but never checked. (Not sure if it includes the number or only less than, or if anything special happens after 70%
1:10 (attacker got less than 10%)
2:10 (attacker got less than 20%) Aka 1:5
3:10 (attacker got less than 30%)
4:10 (attacker got less than 40%) aka 2:5
5:10 (attacker got less than 50%) aka 1:2
6:10 (attacker got less than 60%) aka 3:5
7:10 (attacker got less than 70%)
8:10 (attacker got less than 80%) aka 4:5
9:10 (attacker got less than 90%)
10:10 (attacker got 100% or 3 flames)
15:10 (attacker got 4 flames)
20:10 (attacker got 5 flames)
And recovery I’ve never tested beyond 1:10 and 20:10 situation. But I wouldn’t expect max loss (good battle results) at 40-59% range… should be closer to half way between 66 and 100, lost troops should be closer to 16.5% I would think
So thats what I’m trying to get at. When you get max 1:10, you not only get a smaller amount of glory (as you lost less troops), you also get a poorer revive rate as more troops are permanently killed.
Assuming your table is right, then 50% is the sweet spot for max glory per run and revive rate.
Don’t forget each battle you also spent resources such as hammers etc so you gotta try to be efficient
Not certain the table is right. It should be close to right though.
I think the sweet spot really depends on what you are going for. If you just want to get the most glory per troop, it’s always 2:1 or better ratio. You just may need to attack more and spend more time.
If the sweetspot is factoring in enemy troops as a resource it’s exactly 2:1
The revives don’t work in your favor. I’ve mathemeticlly proven the max opportunity at 2:1 outweighs the recovery benefit… that is the most glory per troop lost is 2:1 and exceeding 2:1 doesn’t improve the situation but it does cause the enemy to burn more troops. (Which in combat is important)
If you want to get as much glory as fast as possible and generate lots of revives for a troop train or something then it might be like 50%, or it might be at 1:1 (3 flames) if there is better recovery than 5 flames. I’ve never done the math for quickest.
I do often swap to use 2 or 3 dragons on attack or let my base get beaten so that I can get more glory due to increased troop loss on my side. But that’s more about trying to get glory faster and having a limited supply of enemy troops.
Context: glory hunting (i.e. not protecting your own castle) as a defender
Aim 1: get as much glory as possible in as short a time as possible
Aim 2: maximise troop revive count (given aim 1)
From the above context, then it appears you should try to aim for 1:2 (own troops killed : enemy troops killed) as that gives you the max glory per troop AND the max own troops killed amount = max glory per run.
It also gives you the best troop revive ratio given a max glory earn out.
Does this make sense? (not sarcastic question - genuinely want to test my understanding)
Generally speaking this means 2:1 attacks (in your favor. Not 1:2) (I usually use the first number as attacker which most glory hunting surrounds attacking)
Getting less than 2:1 wont get you more glory in a single attack so it is the fastest way to get glory. Since you can’t control primarch ratios it is often good to nerf on attack to compensation by as much as 3 dragons by the lead attacker. Doing worse is a hard cutoff that will not be better than 3 flames.
On defense it’s harder to nerf. I think around 50% might be close to an idea range but not 100% sure.
Because you lose less troops AND revives cost 20%, the combination makes 0 revives the cheapest. If you want this just so you have more to revive my primary thought is just to attack more. But if there is a difference in revives between 1 flame and 3 flames you can theoretically find a natural primarch ratio of close to 2:1 and then use 3 dragons getting better revive while getting optimal kills too. Anything else and you are trading glory for revives because below that primarch ratios are overridden by by the modifier rather than applied to the modifier.
And if you wanted to trade glory for revives, it’s kind of like how much are you wanting to trade. Not really a sweet spot there beyond what feels right. (What you are okay sacrificing)
when you get this please explain to me in simpler term
assume I have 1000 troop. throw them in defence and have 69% base destroyed. I lose 1000 get 1500 glory and revive 1000 back.
with the same 1000. throw them in defence and have 1% base destroy. I lose 1000 get 1500 glory and revive back 660 troop.
It doesnt make sense too. Seem like 2 choices:
let them beat you then revive over and over 1000 troop to get infinite glory
dont let them do a single thing then revive less and less lead to a certain amount of glory