Why I can no longer rationalize spending on this game

So PG’s response inspired me to crunch some numbers. I had posted previously that it would cost about $2000 to get my kill island to all 85s. Since those posts, I’ve chipped away at the levels a little bit (not enough), and began wondering what it would take to get all of my current towers to 85.

So, using Mechengg’s spreadsheets to ensure I was properly considering event prizes, I learned that it would take about five years of playing without spending to get my existing towers all to 85 (this includes two perches). I currently use the two small islands and the long middle, so we are talking four islands total. What’s more, my first small island has three flaks and a perch that need to be leveled (the other two are already 85). My second small island is all 85, except for the perch. I am me in game, so feel free to take a look.

In figuring out what it would take, timers were by far the biggest gating item, then pearls, then embers. I assumed that I would always get at least to the 450 sigil Mark, that my D2 team would always place between 6th and 10th, and that we would always get level 10 quest chests.

Well, five years seems way too long, and undoubtedly by that time, 85s would be meaningless, so I decided to factor in some spending as well. The best value is the $99 pack during pvp with 25 gold chests and 35,000 rubies, so I used one such pack per pvp. Because I assumed embers would be the most important, I opened these hypothetical packs during fort. What I learned is:

If I spend $7,000 over the next 110 weeks, I can have all my current towers and my two perches at level 85.

So, $7,000 saves me three years, but it still takes two years of playing to max my base. And by then, I doubt it would be maxed.

I have no problem spending when I see the value and the resulting progression. I am far from being a whale, but I have spent regularly on this game. I kind of need to, I’m a crappy flier, a crappy base builder, and a crappy planner. But, I can no longer rationalize the kind of spending this game requires to be relevant in competitive leagues. I have 250 days on legacy elite and 14 days left on atlas, and am also debating whether to continue spending on elite.

I hope that those of you considering what you want out of this game (and are willing to put into it), particularly those of you asking how many flaks you can support or when you can afford flaks, can learn something from this. I’m not calling for a boycott (at least certainly not in this post), and please understand how much I enjoy playing this game. But, I simply can no longer rationalize the terrible value proposition that PG seems unwilling to address.


My reasons are similar to yours but for the poor experience regarding bugs with android.

The bugs now make my game hang about 50x a day (FAILED TO LOAD ATLAS) and require me to reboot my phone at least 20x a day. The game is way worse now than it was 6 months ago despite all the “bug fixing”…

It’s just not as fun anymore to play this game and to pay a company who gives such a terrible user experience makes less and less sense.

I’m beggining to feel like the game is on it’s way out now and not worth fixing and they are just going to let it slowly die while feeding us shiney new things to encourage every last little bit of spending before everyone quits. If they had a huge user base that was spending or the game was growing they would see the benefit in improving it but they clearly don’t. If it’s not worth it to them, so it’s not worth it to me.

Any money spent now is a waste if you ask me.


THIS!! I posted some similar thoughts under the Change the Way Packs are Priced thread. But my thoughts were just based on intuition and general impression of progress. I really like how you fleshed it out with a detailed analysis. Thank you so much for this, this is awesome!

I think your results lay it quite bare to see: this game has another spending problem besides the “pay to win” problem. It also has a “pay a little and have nothing to show for it” problem. The game only rewards large volume spenders.


@Gyga PS if you have the time, I would love to see the results at various different spending levels. Using your base as a benchmark, you could make a graph of time to reach level 85 versus weekly spend $$ and see what the graph looks like. It would be fascinating I’m sure.

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Doesn’t matter what you spend or don’t spend…
They have 200-300 whales to finance all their efforts. This is why none of the rest of our opinions matter.
When someone can drop 20k on an event?
Who gives a $hit about you taking 3 years? To get to content that will be old in next 3 months?

The fact that even one person spent over $600,000! On this “game” is insane! Let alone 100’s dropping 15-20K PER event!


People can spend what they want to spend, I’m not judging (except you F2P folks that increase the costs for the rest of us :wink:).

The issue that I am trying to illustrate is the lack of sustainability. If you can’t or won’t spend the kind of money it takes to be at the top (and stay there), why spend at all? You are only falling farther and farther behind.

This disincentive will choke off the supply of future spenders and encourage them to play and spend elsewhere.

Moreover, even if you assume that these 200-300 whales provide the main source of revenue (what would you say? 70%? 80%? 90%), would you really want to take a top line hit of 10-30% because you alienated the remaining spending group?


Some companies survive in as little as 3% margin year to year. Promise everyone that revenue has dropped more than that recently.

You’re talking margin, now ask those companies if they want to take a 10-30% hit to revenue. Or better yet, ask them if they want to explain to their shareholders that they took a hit and why.

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Sounds like the big spenders want the game to themselves. But for the rest of us with a budget, it’s hard to justify spending when the product has constant issues with basic gameplay and continuity.

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Whatever the source, they’re part of the community too.

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I’m not sure where this is coming from. I don’t think we have any big spenders on our team, but I assume they want the same things that you do, they just go about it differently.

I totally understand that… to run your business based of that type of spending it blatantly stupid.

Eventually, even the spoiled brats will get bored and waste that money else where. While those same people kill off your base of players the only thing left will be them.

Gluttony is real. We’re at the point where the whales have eaten everything and at point there is nothing left so now the whole ecosystem dies!


I could, my spreadsheet isn’t pretty and I didn’t set it up to run scenarios. For the spend piece, I simply took one $99 pack each pvp (so $300 every five weeks) and opened it during fort to maximize embers.

I have connection issues out the a$$, constantly having atlas to fail loading, can’t view emojis. And to be told “it’s you not us” is crap. I am just saying I enjoy the game and pay for elite but still get an unstable product. I feed into the uninstall reinstall app before I thought about my other apps and how I DON’T have to uninstall reinstall every other week or close the apps and reopen the app 20 times a day. These are basic stability issues which I highly doubt the big spenders are dealing with or would put with.

I would imagine much of the costs for this game are fixed. Probably 70/30 or so, just to spitball.

So a 10% revenue reduction may well wipe out a bottom line and put a product or company in the red.

To be fair @Gyga I don’t understand the reasoning behind your base. I think your leveling 5 towers for no reason

You look like your trying to have a mix between a small base and a middle long base and it’s all in the middle of your base. Your base could be a lot more effective if it was actually a middle long base.

Your 85s on first island in the middle long, behind it the other 60-70 flaks and another 1-2 mages.
With this you really only have to worry about 10 towers and your base would be a lot more tougher.

Right now your base is an island to long, you could
Scrap the level 40-50 towers and just focus on the 10 in the middle.
Then you only have to worry about leveling those back 5 towers since your kill is maxed.

Or…If you wanted your kill on a short perch island why not use the first 3 islands? This way you
Have your kill island on perch island and then have another island with farms on back home island, 6 more towers.

Omg :joy: And how do you know any of this? :roll_eyes:

I doubt the biggest spenders in game are teenagers with an allowance but if that’s what you want to believe then go for it :+1:

One thing I have noted in my years is that when a person seeks to discredit a sound hypothesis they question the knowledge of those who posited the hypothesis. If you cant attack the idea, attack the person who had it.

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Didn’t know I attacked you lol